Category: Safe Haven
It's hard for a rational person to walk by faith, especially in these times of great controversy. Even before I was born, the controversy over whether or not God exists had been raging for thousands of years.
I often ask myself: "Can I know which opinion was first: God exists or God does not exist? Did either of these two opinions exist without being challenged? Would it make a difference to me if it were possible to know which opinion existed first? If my opinion existed first without having been challenged, would it hold greater weight over an opposing opinion?"
I've come to believe that these questions are unanswerable. I mean, how can I know if claims contained in any sacred scripture are true if I can't even know which existed first? There is no scripture that speaks to me from out of a time during which the beliefs it contains were not challenged.
Every belief I've ever read of or heard of has always had a challenge, something that contradicts it. Yet there is no way of knowing which was first. I believe that knowing which came first gives irrefutable authority to that belief, and only as such, can a belief be lived out rationally. Of course, the belief would have to be one that matched my morals or that encouraged a better way to live.
If there were a source that spoke to me out of a time during which it could be seen that a certain way of life was dominant, and that this way of life was unchallenged, then I could safely determine that that way of life was based on unchallenged truth. But as far as I know, no such system of beliefs has ever existed.
To Be Continued...
There would need to be a source, perhaps a prehistoric source or something, that could tell us what thinking humans based their moral conduct on. This source would have to be unchallenged, free from controversy. For example, the source would have to say something like this: "We believe in God, and there is no other belief to challenge us." Or if it were a source that spoke for atheists: "We don't believe in God, and there is no other belief to challenge us."
But seeing that there is no such source, there is no way of knowing which belief existed, unchallenged, first before the controversy.
For example, it was once believed that the shape of the earth was flat, and once science discovered that the earth was instead round, a controversy was born. Through the course of time all have come to accept the claims of science. but even before such claims, the Bible had already claimed this a thousand years earlier. So it is safe to believe what the Bible says in this case. The believer can have assurance of the truth of the Bible's claim in this case. But when it comes to matters of faith, such as believing in God, it cannot be proven. Sure, the Bible and other sacred scripture claim that God exists, but these claims originated in a time when atheists already lived, atheists and believers have coexisted since as far back as recorded history can tell. These religious claims have always been contradicted. The atheist's claims have always been contradicted.
So my question to anyone who holds any type of religious belief is: If you cannot prove whether or not the doctrines you believe in ever existed unchallenged, how can you claim that your beliefs are based on truth or how can you live your life according to your system of beliefs?
This is a sincere question from a person who is open-minded. I am still searching for answers...answers, perhaps, that will possibly not be found in this lifetime.
...and then again might be found in this Life-Time...???
I am just like you just waiting for answers.
I truly wish the person who babbled on post three would make use of the four thousand characters given because what is written there makes no sense to me at all.
And the same goes for the person who babbled in post four.
If you took the time to read and consider this post then the least you can do is give a reason as to why you agree or disagree with what you've read. Or if you didn't understand what was said you should have at least asked for clarification. You make yourselves look bad by not elaborating on why you disagree or agree with what you've read.
If you don't care about the topic of this post then just disregard it completely without leaving a reply.
This is a website where people are supposed to exchange thoughts and learn from each other.
PersonRaskolnikov/eerie silence,
You must be under the influence of complete lunacy, Ha ha ha!
Why don't you tell me what you think about what that particular scripture says so that we can converse as do normal speking human beings? I'd truly like to know because I don't care about your personal study, I prefer to hear what you have to say about what's in your mind.
Truly judgmental aren't you thusly appearing PersonRaskolnikov..??
I apologize.
When I used the word "normal" I was refering to all the footnotes and exaggerated explanatory measures you took. I wasn't attacking your character.
Please let's try to keep this conversation on topic, That is, if you'd still like, because as it now appears, we're not getting anywhere.
I don't know what it takes to get the attention of people on this board. Why isn't anybody posting to this subject? It must be boring to them I guess. Maybe if I'd chosen a different subject title they'd be more interested.
Maybe I just need to get a life.
Where else can I go?
I find your post very interesting, Raskolnikov, but I don't usually get into these types of discussions. My own beliefs are very fragile. In other words, I guess I am an agnostic too. That is, I'm not an athist who absolutely refuses to believe there is a God, but I guess I can't really claim to be a good Christian either. It just all boggles my mind. I want to believe in life after death, angels, that good triumphs over evil, etc. But it's not easy.
And as for why more people haven't been adding posts to your topic, I think a lot of people are like me in that they tend to stay away from topics where arguments might ensue. As for myself, I tend to post jokes to the joke board and play the word games that people have posted to the game board. But I don't often like to get into discussions about controversial subjects. I would rather do that sort of thing in person with people, but not here on the zone where I mostly just want to have some fun.
So then I do need to get a life...ha ha ha!
Buckeye Fan, I understand what you're saying. But I wasn't looking to start an argument when I posted this topic. I have a lot of questions on my mind, questions that I think are important, and seeing that there are a lot of christians here, I thought I'd give them an opportunity to share their thoughts with me. I thought these christians would be willing and would jump at the opportunity to defend or speak up for what they believe, I mean, I thought they were supposed to tell everyone about Jesus.
My ears aren't closed to what they have to say because I'm truly considering to devote my life to a higher power. I guess you can say that I've come to a point in my life where the supernatural is breaking through to my conscience. But I just don't know--with so many religions in the world--which is the true one.
Maybe they're afraid to confront someone like me because perhaps my questions would cause them to doubt. I honestly understand that. But I know that nobody has ever understood things concerning god. I wouldn't judge them if they couldn't answer my questions.
But I guess you're right, this isn't the place to do that. I've learned that the hard way and now I know that. That doesn't mean I'm going to give up, though. I know some good friends near my old neighborhood who are christians, maybe I'll pay them a visit some time soon.
Oh yeah, I hope you find answers to the questions you have. When I think about it, though, I think we're all going to have to find these answers on our own and maybe god, if there is such a being, will deal with us individually.
I didn't mean that I thought you were here to start arguments, and I don't think you should stop asking questions just because you're not getting a lot of replies. I was just speaking for myself when I said I tend to avoid controversial topics on boards such as this and would rather tackle sticky questions in person with people I feel comfortable talking to. On here, you just never know who might attack you, and I don't feel like arguing with strangers.
Hello,
I have been a Christian for years and have had dozens of experiences of answered prayers and/or divine intervention. As of right now, I am even attending Bible school to help understand more of the scriptures I read and how they can apply to my life and my understanding of who God is and what He has done and/or will do.
I thought that, attending Bible school, I would have answers to the questions I have had. Does the Bible make sense? Why does the Bible exist? Why do people, myself included, believe in God, in Jesus Christ, in the Bible? Many of those questions have been answered in these few short weeks, but I am finding that I am asking myself more questions.
Do I believe because that's how I was raised, or do I believe because I made a conscious choice to believe?
Is being a good person enough? If so, then why believe in God at all? If not, then why do good works in the first place?
There are other questions, but you get the idea. Even strong Christians struggle sometimes with what they believe and why. It's only normal to wrestle with the questions that you have.
I'd be more than willing to discuss this further with you if you'd like.
Thanks,
Kate
I think so called "Christians" who don't wrestle with these issues and think they have all the answers are the ones I stay away from. But if a Christian is willing to admit they don't have all the answers, I am much more willing to talk to them. It's the oens who act like they know everything and pass judgment on others all the time who drive me crazy.